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	<title>Comments on: Culture, Tradition and Race</title>
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	<link>http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/2005/03/31/culture_tradition_and_race/</link>
	<description>The truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 11:36:01 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Wannabe Lawyer  &#187; Blog Archive   &#187; Everything that is wrong with our scholar selection process</title>
		<link>http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/2005/03/31/culture_tradition_and_race/#comment-1990</link>
		<dc:creator>Wannabe Lawyer  &#187; Blog Archive   &#187; Everything that is wrong with our scholar selection process</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Apr 2005 19:52:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/?p=92#comment-1990</guid>
		<description>[...]  qualities existing in the same person. 	I have already debunked the myth of racial purity here, I don&#8217;t think I need to repeat arguments already made. And this p [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...]  qualities existing in the same person. 	I have already debunked the myth of racial purity here, I don&#8217;t think I need to repeat arguments already made. And this p [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Han</title>
		<link>http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/2005/03/31/culture_tradition_and_race/#comment-1753</link>
		<dc:creator>Han</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Apr 2005 17:34:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/?p=92#comment-1753</guid>
		<description>ciotog:

&lt;blockquote&gt;you seem to move between using race in a biological context and in a sociological context.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

well, you could say I am &lt;a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race" rel="nofollow"&gt;discounting a biological basis for race altogether&lt;/a&gt;.

&lt;blockquote&gt;85 percent of human variation occurs within populations, and not between populations, argued that neither "race" nor "subspecies" were appropriate or useful ways to describe populations (Lewontin 1973). Some researchers report the variation between racial groups (measured by Sewall Wright's population structure statistic FST) accounts for as little as 5-7% of human genetic variation.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

As such, my personal references to 'race' are exclusively sociological in nature, and the only times when I do refer to 'race' in a biological context is when I am criticising that very usage.

&lt;blockquote&gt;Taking a sociological definition of race, there are many ?races? out there who have a culture markedly defined by their ?racial? heritage.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Let us consider this thought experiment. Think of a 'racial' group, any one of your choice, which has distinctive cutural practices traceable to their 'racial' heritage. And then, let us take a newborn baby of that 'race', and raise the child in a family of a completely different 'race'.

What would the result be? Granted, the very first flaw in this experiment is that if the child grows up in a society where every other person treats him or her differently because he or she looks substantially different, then the child will surely feel dislocated from that society.

But imagine for a moment now, that any physical differences are minimal. Would the child retain the cultural characteristics of his or her own 'race'? Or would he or she grow up with the cultural characteristics of the adoptive parents?

I still argue that 'race' is a pure social construct. 'Race' is irrelevant if the environment is changed i.e. do black kids in the US have more in common culturally with black kids in Africa or with white kids in the USA?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ciotog:</p>
<blockquote><p>you seem to move between using race in a biological context and in a sociological context.</p></blockquote>
<p>well, you could say I am <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race" rel="nofollow">discounting a biological basis for race altogether</a>.</p>
<blockquote><p>85 percent of human variation occurs within populations, and not between populations, argued that neither &#8220;race&#8221; nor &#8220;subspecies&#8221; were appropriate or useful ways to describe populations (Lewontin 1973). Some researchers report the variation between racial groups (measured by Sewall Wright&#8217;s population structure statistic FST) accounts for as little as 5-7% of human genetic variation.</p></blockquote>
<p>As such, my personal references to &#8216;race&#8217; are exclusively sociological in nature, and the only times when I do refer to &#8216;race&#8217; in a biological context is when I am criticising that very usage.</p>
<blockquote><p>Taking a sociological definition of race, there are many ?races? out there who have a culture markedly defined by their ?racial? heritage.</p></blockquote>
<p>Let us consider this thought experiment. Think of a &#8216;racial&#8217; group, any one of your choice, which has distinctive cutural practices traceable to their &#8216;racial&#8217; heritage. And then, let us take a newborn baby of that &#8216;race&#8217;, and raise the child in a family of a completely different &#8216;race&#8217;.</p>
<p>What would the result be? Granted, the very first flaw in this experiment is that if the child grows up in a society where every other person treats him or her differently because he or she looks substantially different, then the child will surely feel dislocated from that society.</p>
<p>But imagine for a moment now, that any physical differences are minimal. Would the child retain the cultural characteristics of his or her own &#8216;race&#8217;? Or would he or she grow up with the cultural characteristics of the adoptive parents?</p>
<p>I still argue that &#8216;race&#8217; is a pure social construct. &#8216;Race&#8217; is irrelevant if the environment is changed i.e. do black kids in the US have more in common culturally with black kids in Africa or with white kids in the USA?</p>
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		<title>By: ciotog</title>
		<link>http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/2005/03/31/culture_tradition_and_race/#comment-1750</link>
		<dc:creator>ciotog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Apr 2005 17:10:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/?p=92#comment-1750</guid>
		<description>An interesting post but I think you could broaden it out a bit more by giving some context to the way you use specific terms. Race is a good example because you seem to move between using race in a biological context and in a sociological context. 

I would agree with your assertion on culture not being a monolith but then your comparison of the two students almost treats culture as such. I would expect that their experience of contemporary culture would differ but they perhaps share other areas of culture (language, festivities, music, art etc.). This would be along the lines of the paragraph in which you described the shared cultural experiences of the Malay, Indian and Chinese people in Singapore.

I would generally disagree with the idea that race is not significant in culture. Taking a sociological definition of race, there are many 'races' out there who have a culture markedly defined by their 'racial' heritage. Perhaps, in a Singaporean context though this is correct. I'm not Singaporean so I'm taking a different experience into this discussion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>An interesting post but I think you could broaden it out a bit more by giving some context to the way you use specific terms. Race is a good example because you seem to move between using race in a biological context and in a sociological context. </p>
<p>I would agree with your assertion on culture not being a monolith but then your comparison of the two students almost treats culture as such. I would expect that their experience of contemporary culture would differ but they perhaps share other areas of culture (language, festivities, music, art etc.). This would be along the lines of the paragraph in which you described the shared cultural experiences of the Malay, Indian and Chinese people in Singapore.</p>
<p>I would generally disagree with the idea that race is not significant in culture. Taking a sociological definition of race, there are many &#8216;races&#8217; out there who have a culture markedly defined by their &#8216;racial&#8217; heritage. Perhaps, in a Singaporean context though this is correct. I&#8217;m not Singaporean so I&#8217;m taking a different experience into this discussion.</p>
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		<title>By: pea</title>
		<link>http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/2005/03/31/culture_tradition_and_race/#comment-1708</link>
		<dc:creator>pea</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Mar 2005 13:19:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/?p=92#comment-1708</guid>
		<description>not himbo but just plain weird i guess :\ sometimes even creepy!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>not himbo but just plain weird i guess :\ sometimes even creepy!</p>
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		<title>By: Kwok Heng</title>
		<link>http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/2005/03/31/culture_tradition_and_race/#comment-1707</link>
		<dc:creator>Kwok Heng</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Mar 2005 12:32:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/?p=92#comment-1707</guid>
		<description>pea:

So we can safely assume that he's a himbo? :D</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>pea:</p>
<p>So we can safely assume that he&#8217;s a himbo? <img src='http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: phelan</title>
		<link>http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/2005/03/31/culture_tradition_and_race/#comment-1705</link>
		<dc:creator>phelan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Mar 2005 02:24:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/?p=92#comment-1705</guid>
		<description>Nice post on the concepts of culture and race. Indeed sociologists are very picky over how they define culture and also question the concept of "race" &lt;em&gt;Ngiao&lt;/em&gt; people huh hehe

And mine wasnt a first hand account. I only read the ST article and was then prompted to share my experience.

Cheers!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice post on the concepts of culture and race. Indeed sociologists are very picky over how they define culture and also question the concept of &#8220;race&#8221; <em>Ngiao</em> people huh hehe</p>
<p>And mine wasnt a first hand account. I only read the ST article and was then prompted to share my experience.</p>
<p>Cheers!</p>
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		<title>By: pea</title>
		<link>http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/2005/03/31/culture_tradition_and_race/#comment-1704</link>
		<dc:creator>pea</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Mar 2005 02:12:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/?p=92#comment-1704</guid>
		<description>Aye to clarify, that guy's a media whore. he told our NTU reporters he assumed channelU would be there and hence the extravaganza. 

And he's downright weird la. Though the King of Kings (some pageant shit for all the hall/school/blah kings), he never failed to amaze people with his silly antics.

Once he went up to this acquaintance of mine and went, "I think you're good-looking, and good looking people are worthy to be friends with. Let's be friends."

And not to mention the massive rumours about him shitting into the washing machine/laundry (cos someone removed his clothes from it) going around.

P.S. I spoke to Bala too! :D</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aye to clarify, that guy&#8217;s a media whore. he told our NTU reporters he assumed channelU would be there and hence the extravaganza. </p>
<p>And he&#8217;s downright weird la. Though the King of Kings (some pageant shit for all the hall/school/blah kings), he never failed to amaze people with his silly antics.</p>
<p>Once he went up to this acquaintance of mine and went, &#8220;I think you&#8217;re good-looking, and good looking people are worthy to be friends with. Let&#8217;s be friends.&#8221;</p>
<p>And not to mention the massive rumours about him shitting into the washing machine/laundry (cos someone removed his clothes from it) going around.</p>
<p>P.S. I spoke to Bala too! <img src='http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: AcidFlask</title>
		<link>http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/2005/03/31/culture_tradition_and_race/#comment-1701</link>
		<dc:creator>AcidFlask</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Mar 2005 01:09:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/?p=92#comment-1701</guid>
		<description>Sadly, it still gels with the convenient fiction of a "Malay-Muslim" community that is so cherished by the Singapore government. As if Chinese people, for example, cannot be Muslim.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sadly, it still gels with the convenient fiction of a &#8220;Malay-Muslim&#8221; community that is so cherished by the Singapore government. As if Chinese people, for example, cannot be Muslim.</p>
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		<title>By: Han</title>
		<link>http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/2005/03/31/culture_tradition_and_race/#comment-1693</link>
		<dc:creator>Han</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Mar 2005 19:47:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/?p=92#comment-1693</guid>
		<description>Agagooga:

I didn't know you're a grammar nazi. :D

And anyway, no one's talking about censorship here. I support free speech, no matter how loony, remember?

I support free speech so that I can lay the smackdown on morons like that when they crawl out of the woodwork.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agagooga:</p>
<p>I didn&#8217;t know you&#8217;re a grammar nazi. <img src='http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>And anyway, no one&#8217;s talking about censorship here. I support free speech, no matter how loony, remember?</p>
<p>I support free speech so that I can lay the smackdown on morons like that when they crawl out of the woodwork.</p>
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		<title>By: Agagooga</title>
		<link>http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/2005/03/31/culture_tradition_and_race/#comment-1689</link>
		<dc:creator>Agagooga</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Mar 2005 19:00:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shianux.jiyuuu.org/?p=92#comment-1689</guid>
		<description>The trouble with condemning heretics is that heretical views will be driven underground to fester.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The trouble with condemning heretics is that heretical views will be driven underground to fester.</p>
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